It’s the end for ‘The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel.’ Rachel Brosnahan, Michael Zegen discuss show

It’s the end of the road for an Emmy- and Golden Globe-winning comedy series.

“The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel” is back for its fifth and final season, with episodes dropping weekly starting April 14 on Amazon Prime Video. 

For this episode of Streamed & Screened, hosts Bruce Miller and Terry Lipshetz, provide a (mostly) spoiler-free analysis of the the program, which is a favorite of both. Also hear from the stars, including clips from Rachel Brosnahan (Miriam “Midge” Maisel), Alex Borstein (Susie Myerson), Tony Shalhoub (Abraham “Abe” Weissman) and Kevin Pollak (Moishe Maisel) who reflect on the characters, the series and whether we might see them all reprise their roles in the future as part of a feature-length movie.

Bruce also has an interview with Michael Zegen, who plays Midge’s ex-husband Joel Maisel, who offers thoughts of his own on the program.

Whether you’re a longtime fan of the show or looking for an introduction before you binge the whole thing over a long weekend, you’ll want to give this episode a listen.

Read more: REVIEW: ‘Mrs. Maisel’ ends with marvelous update

Where to watch: Amazon Prime Video

• Rachel Brosnahan as Miriam “Midge” Maisel
• Alex Borstein as Susie Myerson
• Michael Zegen as Joel Maisel
• Marin Hinkle as Rose Weissman
• Tony Shalhoub as Abraham “Abe” Weissman
• Kevin Pollak as Moishe Maisel
• Caroline Aaron as Shirley Maisel
• Luke Kirby as Lenny Bruce
• Jane Lynch as Sophie Lennon

Created by: Amy Sherman-Palladino

Executive producers: Amy Sherman-Palladino, Daniel Palladino

Producers: Dhana Gilbert, Matthew Shapiro, Salvatore Carino, Sheila Lawrence

Streamed & Screened is a podcast about movies and TV hosted by Bruce Miller, a longtime entertainment reporter who is now the editor of the Sioux City Journal in Iowa and Terry Lipshetz, a senior producer for Lee Enterprises based in Madison, Wisconsin.

Note: The following transcript was created by Adobe Premiere and may contain misspellings and other inaccuracies as it was generated automatically:

A lot of young women trying standup comedy for the first time, which is so awesome and long overdue. It’s been incredible to hear how his legacy has already affected people, and I’m really excited to see how she lives on.

That voice you just heard was Rachel Brosnahan, who stars as Miriam ‘Midge’ Maisel in ‘The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel’ I’m Terry Lipshetz, a senior producer at Lee Enterprises and a co-host of Streamed and Screened, an entertainment podcast about movies and TV. Joining me, as always, is the incomparable Bruce Miller, editor of the Sioux City Journal and a longtime entertainment reporter.

The Marvelous Mrs. Maisel is back for its fifth and final season with episodes dropping weekly starting April 14th on Amazon Prime Video. Bruce It will be an end of an era for one of the most popular shows on that platform. Certainly big shoes to fill.

First of all, why was it not the marvelous Bruce Miller? This is now this is how this should be. This is how he introduced me. Right. It’s interesting because this is a show that I think people lost track of because of the big gaps between seasons. Was it over? Is it over? And when they see this fifth season and I’ve seen the whole thing, they will go, Oh my God, there’s so much in that fifth season because they do a lot of time jumps.

So you’re not going to just see one season, one year play out. It goes into the future and you find out things about her children. You find out things about her husband, her ex-husband, her friends, Susie. All of those people come into play at some point. And so it flashes back and forth and it’s I think it pays.

It rewards the people who have been loyal. And you get to see a lot of fun. So there is and I you know, I’m really I should say nothing. But there is one kind of cute thing where they’re showing, you know, did she have a lot of dresses? And they show the racks of her clothes all. My God, what is this?

She did have it because I don’t think she ever wore anything twice. No, I don’t remember it. And you also, I think, see growth in Mrs. Maysles comedy career, how she’s able to tell, you know, I always thought, is she making this crap up on the fly? And every night, is she not writing this down so that she can, you know, retell it at another place?

It seemed like every every routine she did was just of the moment. And you see how she does all that. And there is a scene in the last episode that is on Be Livable, and that’s as much as I can tell you on the spoiler end of things. But okay, no spoilers. You know, when you first watched it, what surprised you most about it?

For me personally, I was sucked in because I’m a native of New York City, okay? And for me, my wife is from just outside of Green Bay, Wisconsin. And it’s been an interesting ride because she’s she’s Catholic. I was raised Catholic, but my dad was Jewish. But for me, it’s kind of seeing that cultural the cultural phenomenon of New York, the Jewish culture, even though I’m I didn’t grow up in the fifties or sixties, I was born in the mid seventies, but for me I could relate to it.

And I thought that they kept this show like it’s fiction, but it’s also really easy. And I think it was that reality that kind of kept bringing me back. So a couple of things, if you don’t mind me throwing these out, because we’re going to be talking a lot about I mean, we’re basically going to just talk about the show with Mrs. Basil.

Yes, this is the Mrs. Maisel episode. So first off, the beauty of streaming is if you have not watched this show yet, just go back and watch it. You know, go get Amazon Prime if you don’t have it already and start cranking through them. My wife and I didn’t start this until the 2020 lockdown. There was already in between season three and seven season for that really long gap they were talking about.

But we had nothing to watch during it. So we’re kind of crushing through Netflix and Hulu and anything we could find. And we hopped into Mrs. Maisel and for some reason I didn’t know much about it at the time. I was saying, What is this like some superhero thing? Because it kind of played with some of those Marvel titles that you hear.

But it’s a it’s a comedy. It takes place, I guess, you know, like late 1950s, early 1960s. Rachael Brosnahan plays Miriam Midge Maisel. She’s a housewife with very strong Jewish personalities in her life. Between her her husband and her parents and her in-laws. Alex Borstein plays Susie Myerson. She manages The Gaslight Cafe.

She wants to be a manager. She’s there. Michael Zegen is Joel Maisel while her husband and there’s a Tony Shalhoub is in it as her father. There’s a lot of actors you will know. Kevin Pollak is her father in law. It was a Jane.

Jane Lynch. Yeah. So it’s it’s an awesome ensemble cast. So and it’s also a lot of reality. So Luke Kirby plays Lenny.

Right? So he’s a real person, very controversial comic of the time, but becomes Midge’s friend over time and helps guide her career. Midge Maisel, a fictional character, but she’s based on Joan Rivers, who had a relationship with Lenny Bruce and started at the Gaslight Cafe, which was a real location. It’s where, if you’ve ever heard of a musician named Bob Dylan, you’ve heard of Bob Dylan before.Bruce Never heard of him. Never heard of him.

So he was a young man. Robert Zimmerman out of Hibbing, Minnesota.

Probably did. Well, is he did.

He did well. So he came to New York City and was kind of brought under the wing of a folk singer named Dave Van Ronk, who is who is the mayor of MacDougal Street down in the village of New York City. They performed at the Gaslight. This is a real location. So it’s the beauty of this show is, you know, you’re getting a little bit of a history lesson of the time and it but it’s still a fictional comedy.

It’s hilarious. I love it. It’s very you know, some of it is kind of on the surface kind of comedy and you pick it up really quick. But some of it’s very deep, too, and it kind of gets into, you know, the place of women at the time in the 1950s and, you know, kind of being you’re the housewife.

Take care of the kids. Joel wants to be the comic. He’s the one that’s going to be the comedian. And of course, the tables get turned. But yeah, you’re right. I mean, with the dresses, even as the show progresses and, you know, she’s short on cash, sometimes it’s like, how can you afford this apartment? Where are all these dresses coming from?

The clothing budget does not suffer. She will always have a great outfit. What I find fascinating was each year it got bigger. You know, you start out and it’s kind of like, Oh, this is doing a period show is expensive. And they didn’t. They just threw it out there. They went to a summer camp, you know, and that can’t be easy to recreate, particularly of that era.

Then they go to a USO show, which is huge in an airplane hangar. They go to Paris, for God’s sakes. This season, you’re going to see them in New York and you’re going to see a lot of landmarks in New York, particularly Rockefeller Center, which they use like a drum. They are around that building all the time. So that’s that’s fascinating to see.

And the cast, there are so many people over those four seasons that get a return visit in the fifth. So it’s it’s kind of like a reunion. And you go, Oh my God, That was from remember when they did that? And she was in that. And then there’s also a bit of, Oh, how can I how can I say this without saying this?

It reminds you of if you saw my favorite year, if you saw laughter on the 23rd floor, if you saw any of those kind of looks at what Sid Caesar, Imogene Coca, Carl Reiner and Howard Morris did during the early days of television. With your show of shows, there are references to those kinds of things, so you get a real sense of the time.

I think you really get to see what the fifties and sixties were like. There’s a sort of Johnny Carson character. They mentioned Jack Paar in the course of the the series. What I love are these time jumps where you find out exactly what happened to Mrs. Maisel. What did she fizzle out and become? Nothing. Did she come a big star?

Was she like Joan Rivers? You know, that is an easy comparison. But there were other female comics of the time, Tony Fields, if you remember that name. I don’t know if it moms Mabley, these were all ones who were working that Phyllis Diller. And they kind of had to be aggressive in their approach to comedy because otherwise they were going to just be bulldozed over.

And I think that’s what you get out of out of Midge, is that she is not going to take no, but she is going to get knocked down.

I can’t wait to dive into this. It’s exciting. I always love those just the characters. They even if they’re playing such a really small role, it feels like they’re playing a much larger role than it actually turns out to be.

There are little in this one, you know. I don’t know if you ever remember those kind of industrial shows that used to be big in New York, where it would be like, Oh, soap or whatever. And they do a huge thing for all of their their corporate people around the country. They’d come in for a day or whatever a weekend, and they do an industrial show, which we are.

A lot of Broadway people would get on stage and sing the praises of, you know, Lox or whatever it might have been, or a new car. And they did these elaborate stage shows and fact there’s a documentary out about them that is just fascinating because it’s a world we don’t know. We weren’t in that industry. We weren’t in that that thing.

But people made a lot of money off that writing those shows. And you get a sense of that as well. There’s a big convention of sorts that that Midge happens to be involved in. So you get another you know, it’s this history lesson that you’re getting a lot of stuff, even though it’s not a real person. You know, if she were real, I think you’d look at it differently.

You would say, Oh, well, you’ve got to have this moment. You’ve got to have that, and you really don’t know what could happen. And Joel does not get shortchanged either. You know, I thought that maybe he would kind of just disappear as the years go by. And he has a very, very strong presence in the final season.

That’s great. I always loved his character. I always was afraid that as the ex-husband, estranged husband, he might just kind of slowly walk out of the show. And in the fact that not only has he remained at the forefront and kind of done his own thing, too, he’s found his place and kind of escaped the shadow of his very overbearing parents.

But the fact that he’s still in it and that his parents are still in it just really makes the whole program him.

And they do interweave those things, too, you know, that he was building a club. He was trying to get a club off the ground. And you’ll see more of that in the next season. And his parents are big players with Mrs. Maysles parents. Interestingly, I don’t think you see enough of Tony Shalhoub. I think he has a very secondary presence in in this year’s show, and that’s surprising because he won an Emmy for it, and I would have thought they would have leaned in a little more, maybe he just wasn’t available to do a lot more.

That’s interesting. I also wonder, too, if it’s is it part of character development, too, where they they want to highlight certain characters each season kind of give them because he did seem to have a very prominent role last year.

When he was doing The Village Voice and he’s a critic. And now he’s getting the reaction to what life is like as a critic, which is I think, just fascinating.

That’s your favorite part, isn’t it?

Yeah, that’s the cool part. Yeah. I lean into the critic aspect. I don’t do I care about the comic? I don’t know if I do, but I do care about the critic.

You know, you talk a little bit about the characters and the reality and whatnot. One of my favorite things from the series and this is because, you know, and we’ve talked about this my my fan of of I’m such a huge fan of music. I have a very large record collection and just I feel like I have a pretty solid knowledge and I’m watching I think it was season it was season three when Midge was out on tour, was Shy Baldwin.

Right. So she was doing comedy to open up for his big band performance. So he was performing. He had that ensemble band behind him. There was the one character who kind of became her friend of sorts. Carol Keane, who is a fictional musician. However, she was based on a real person. She played. Carol Kaye, if you at all familiar with her, is a legendary bassist, and she’s part of what’s known as The Wrecking Crew.

The Wrecking Crew in the 1960s was this group of musicians that would come in and they were studio musicians. So you would have performers who weren’t necessarily the best bands. They would go out live. But when it came to actually recording the albums, the producers were like, Let’s you guys are in quite good enough. And it was even the Beach Boys, like the Beach Boys, didn’t perform their own instruments in the studio.

In a lot of cases. It was a lot of times it was The Wrecking Crew. So Carol Kaye, the real person was the basis to put down the bass line. That famous bass line in In These Boots by Nancy Sinatra. The bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum, bum. So that was Carol Kaye and the fictional character in Mrs. May’s All, who is also the bassist in the band and a befriended Midge and that season.

So that was for me, another piece that I just really love about this.

That’s where rewards you for being astute in other areas, correct?

If you if you know things like if you you know, if you don’t if you don’t know these things, that’s that’s totally fine. You’re just going to be entertained for for an hour or however long the episode is. But if you if you’re familiar with pop culture in any way, you don’t need to just know the real people like Lenny Bruce.

But it’s knowing little things like The Gaslight Cafe. Carol Kaye, These types of people, you know, they are based on actual folks, even if it’s just very loosely.

Yeah, it’s fun to see who they might be. You know, Sophie Lennon, Who is she referring to? Who is she trying to be that you would know as a fellow comedian? You know, is she somebody that or is she just whole cloth, a fresh character? And that’s I think that’s kind of picking the brain of Amy Sherman Palladino, the creator of this show.

If you know her from Gilmore Girls, you know that she loves dance scripts, she loves the idea that there’s there are more words there than really you need to do a half hour or 45 minutes of a show, but she packs it and I would assume it would be very difficult to to learn all those lines, particularly when she wants that kind of rapid fire way of talking.

And that’s how she is. She’s just like that. She usually wears a hat, too. She loves wearing hats. She’s short. She’s not unlike Susie. I would assume that a lot of Susie’s personality comes from Amy, and her husband. Daniel is also a producer on the show, and he writes as well. So they’re they’re kind of in sync with what this mindset is all about.

And I’m sure she had a grand plan as to where she was going to take this whole thing. Now, you can easily see that they might have gone seven or eight years with this, but I think the idea of cutting it off now opens up other opportunities like a movie. And I think for them, let’s let’s try and make the fifth season as packed as we can and then we can go on and do those other things and not have to worry about time limitations or we’ve got to meet a deadline to get this on the air by a certain time because it’s it’s expensive.

Bruce, I don’t think you know this, but you have just set up the perfect segue way into, oh, wow, some audio here. So we already heard from Rachel. Now we’re going to hear from Tony Shalhoub, who plays Midge’s father. He talks about how they didn’t know how long this series was going to go, but felt that both Amy Sherman-Palladino and Dan Palladino were able to wrap up the story perfectly the way it was supposed to be.

So let’s let’s cut ahead to that clip.

From what I understand, even though we didn’t know how many seasons it may go or may not go, Amy and Dan always had, they always had the final scene in their heads. They always they didn’t know exactly how we were going to get there, but they knew where we were going to land and then I think we all by osmosis, we all felt that cool.

All right, so that was Tony Shalhoub. Bruce, does that sound accurate, like what he’s talking about? Does it feel like the series wraps up perfectly?

I think it does for me it did anyway. And I thought, like I say, the last episode is one you can’t miss because it’s and I, I cheated, all right? Because I was afraid I was doing an interview and I thought I better see the end just in case this character is dead. I don’t want to end up asking, Well, like, you know, what about those later years are, well, I’m dead, so I won’t be in those later years.

But that wasn’t the case. There wasn’t anything. But I did watch the last episode before I finished off the other ones before it, and the last episode is a great example of standalone television. You could take that episode out, not see any of the rest of the series, and you would still get a really good sense of a story.

It’s like a little mini movie in itself, and it’s interesting how they all are able to get friends in. There is a roast at one point that has a lot of comedians that you know, are friends of a lot of the actors that are in the shows. And there are ties. I think Rachel’s husband is a character in the show.

There are people that are all people who’ve been on Gilmore Girls, people who’ve been on Bunheads, people who have been, if you will, loyal over the years. And they repay that loyalty by giving them a shot in this last season. I mean, it’s remarkable. If I sat and made a list of all the people that I saw, I, you know, a character that they introduced last season played by Gideon Glick, he’s this magician and kind of an offbeat magician.

And you go, What is this? I love that character. And he returns this season and he has a lot of really goofy things. He’s afraid of flying. So that’s a fear factor. And there there is a picture that you’ll see out there somewhere that is JFK, the the airport. So you’ll be able to see what that looks like inside.

And it’s just fascinating to see these characters. The last time I saw it was Catch Me if you can, and just to look at that and now there’s a hotel there that you can stay at there. It’s very commercial where you could go and actually do tourism things there. But it is featured in this season. Again, huge, huge landmarks that they’re using in New York.

I think it’s fascinating to to realize that somebody didn’t say no. Nobody was saying them, No, you can’t do that. We can’t afford to do that. It’s like I’m sure she dreamed it. And very much like Susie, where she’s not going to let somebody else tell her no, she’s just going to keep going ahead and doing it. And I think that’s in a nutshell.

Amy Palladino I can’t remember the timing of this. Was the JFK airport at the time, or was it still Idlewild?

Yeah, it was, Yeah, it was, but as I know it is.

I know I always wondered because it transitioned.

It was not named. No, it was not named JFK because, you know, and interestingly, I don’t remember that they’ve even mentioned that Kennedy has died at that point. But you’ll see the eighties, you’ll see the nineties, you’ll see the seventies, you’ll see various different time frames over the course of the of the of the episodes.

Wow. So another character that was mentioned and we talked briefly about her was that of Alex Borstein. She plays Susie Myerson. You know, you had mentioned the connection with her to Amy Sherman-Palladino and whether it’s the connection there. But we have a we have a clip of her also. Now, if you’re familiar with her, she’s also the voice of Lois on Family Guy.

She’s a comedian. She’s been around for a really long time. But I think this is kind of like probably her biggest breakthrough screen role that I can think of on screen role. So we have a short clip of her talking about her relationship with Midge. So let’s go to that.

For a bit. Like Mutton, Jeff, It makes no sense. And yet there’s just this chemistry. There’s something that draws these women together and they’ve got each other’s backs and it’s not about finding a mate. It’s about achieving something in their lives that they want. It’s about filling a hole within and they complete each other.

All right, Bruce So that was Alex Borstein talking about the relationship that Susie and Midge have. Is that connection? Because that was always one of my favorite things was the interactions between Midge and Susie and kind of the weird polar opposites that they are, but they have this great presence on screen together. Do we get more of that in this first season?

We do. And you also get fighting. And that’s as much as I can say about that. You know how they it’s like on a soap opera where they love to put people together and then they like to tear them apart. And I think this falls into that. You know, there’s there’s a reason for them to be at each other’s throats and maybe they both don’t pay attention enough to what the needs are of the other person.

But you see how how Susie is just giving her life for this person that maybe she might be a little too protected. You know, Mitch can Mitch has the ability to go and do this because she has her parents to fall back on if she really needs them. Her husband, her ex-husband is still there in the picture for her.

She doesn’t have that kind of if I don’t do this, I don’t know what will happen to my life. There is a safety net for her, and we’ve seen that over the years where she’s taken jobs at other places and done other things and she gets a new job this year. And that’s a safety net of sorts, too.

But there’s always this comedy where Susie has nothing. Susie is like she’s all in and she will do whatever she needs to do to further the career of her client. Hopefully there will be more clients, but you know, you look at it and you say, Oh my God, she’s just doing all this for one person. Is that friendship?

Is that is that, you know, just survival? Is it? She’s enamored with her. What is the what is the deal for her and why is she doing this? And you get answers to all of that stuff. It’s just it’s really fascinating. I remember when they went to the to the Catskills and they were staying there and I think she had a hammer or something.

And she was like trying to do things with the hammer. And you go, Oh my God, this is unreal. And she’s always treated like dirt by everybody. Everybody sees her as like their batboy for anything that goes wrong. Susie, we’re going to go to you.

Yeah, She said that season at the Catskills was just incredible. I mean, they basically took it was pretty much the entire season was more or less on location up there. And you still had to work her in somehow. And she obviously she doesn’t dress like somebody that belongs there. So she just walked around with that hammer and like, I think a plunger, too, just looking like a maintenance worker and nobody would question it because that’s what she did.

But that relationship, you know, even though we’re we’re avoiding spoilers for season five, we had that adversarial give and take relationship between them throughout all the seasons. Because you’re right, she didn’t have anybody. Susie doesn’t have anybody to fall back on, so she has to make a living, which meant at times taking on other clients. You know, she didn’t want to be Sophie Lemon’s manager, but she needed the money and then kind of had to deal with that abuse as well as the abuse of of Midge, who couldn’t believe that she would support Sophie Lennon, who is her her nemesis.

Right. Yeah. So, you know, that that to me has been just a great, you know, relationship. But it always comes back to when they meet in the diner, which is such an iconic New York thing. Like, I just love I miss diners so much. Bruce Living in Wisconsin, there’s no diners out here. People who think there’s diners out here, there is no diners out here that is.

Have a drive thru with it, too, right?

But it’s such a it’s just such a new York, New Jersey, East Coast cultural thing where you go to a diner and you get that triple decker club sandwich or the pastrami or whatever it is and a pile of food.

You come all the other way, it’s on you. Who knows everybody’s order.

Yeah. You know, you get that big pickle spear which probably sits on every plate, and they just move it from plate to plate so I don’t touch it.

The end. They do. Go back to the diner. You’ll be seeing that and you’ll be seeing various and sundry combinations of people talking. So it’s a it’s a key place. And like I say, these sets that they build the apartments, the business places they go to, it’s unbelievable. I don’t know how I would love to see what the budget was for this because it had to be huge because it looks good.

And I there’s a thing and there’s this coming season where they mention something as a giveaway, okay? And I thought, oh no, that it’s it’s wrong. It’s not the same time. And I had to look it up to make sure that that was within that time span. It was exactly in that time span. You know how you would say I like a yo I don’t want to see what it is because again, this is one of those things.

But if it was a yo yo and you say, well, yo, yo, what year was a Rubik’s cube? That would be one a Rubik’s Cube. Why are they giving away Rubik’s cubes? They weren’t available in 62 or 61 were they. I don’t I think they didn’t come until the seventies, but that’s not yet. But there is another thing like that.

And damn, if they didn’t nail it. And I looked it up and it was exactly right, it it fit with the time frame. You’ll see stuff like that that it just you want to play gotcha with them and they, they already know they’re much better than we are at vetting these kinds of things.

Yeah, they, they’re really good. It’s just nailing history. It is a history. Even though it is fiction, it is a history lesson throughout pop culture, history lesson.

Were there characters that you really like that maybe aren’t around or have, you know, dropped in for an episode or two?

Well, you know, the Carol K one was one that I really liked. The magician that was in there in season four when Midge was working at that theater. And, you know, it’s kind of the adult content. It’s not quite a strip club, but it’s that kind of like a doll that the manager of that club was. It’s just a lot of those little characters like that.

I really love the characters that I really felt a personal connection to, and we’ll kind of kind of move this forward too, with some some clips that we have coming up. So we have Michael Zegen, who plays Joel Maze, all his parents. Kevin Pollack plays Moisi Maisel, his father, and then Caroline Aaron plays Shirley Mays or his mother.

So I had mentioned earlier that that my mom was Catholic, my dad is Jewish. His parents, um, his mother died. My, my paternal grandmother died. I was probably about 15 years old when she passed away. She wasn’t a very devout Jewish person.

My grandfather was he was it could be. Yes, it was.

That was probably about it. My grandfather was always a little bit more religious. And then after my grandmother died, he got remarried a year or two later is very quick. And the woman that he married, her name was Mildred. We all called her Millie and they became very devout again. He would go to temple. They kept kosher, but but Millie had a very unique personality.

So when the show started and I started watching it, and when Joel’s parents were finally introduced and Shirley Hazel comes on screen, I turned to my wife immediately and I’m like, Oh my goodness, that is Millie.

Is Millie. Looks like Millie. Sounds like Millie. Acts like Millie. This is not like you can think that that there’s there’s acting here and we’re over the top and there’s no way people could be like this in real life. Surely Basil is Millie or Millie was Shirley. Mabel, whichever reality. So it to me there was just that personal connection that that strong, very strong personality with her.

And in the father, I would I don’t think my grandfather was any way like my she they had certain crossovers but you know Shirley and Millie were two peas in a pod.

Shirley is a big fan of pop culture, and she knows all the names that Midge might throw out there. She has like she could give you an encyclopedia about the person, and she’s so excited about everything. And of course, when Midge invites them to come to various and sundry things, oh, she’s right there. She’s ready to come. Whereas her own mother is like, well, this interrupt with what I’m doing.

I don’t know if I want to come and see you perform in front row is always Shirley. Shirley is there. She’s all, This is wonderful. You’re doing a great job. I love you, you’re great. And you’ll see they do a lot with them during this next year, so you’ll enjoy that.

I’m looking forward to that because that interaction with them and in some ways to my my maternal grandparents who were Catholic, they never interacted that often with each other. But there is always a very strange relationship between like my mom and her parents and my dad and his parents when they would interact. It was very I don’t know if his adversarial is quite the way, but culturally very different.

And I kind of get that with this show, like like Midge and her parents were very much one way, and Joel and his parents are very much another. And there is that that onscreen dynamic that I just love. And it kind of clicks with me a bit.

Yeah, and they’re together a lot. The four of them do a lot of things together. You’ll be you’ll be thrilled.

You know, speaking of Moisi, Mazal, we do have one more clip of Kevin Pollak, and he’s talking a little bit about the future of Mrs. Maisel. So let’s go to that.

Yeah, we’re not going to ever say goodbye. And I predict now for you, in 4.3 years we’ll be here talking about the amazing movie. There I said it.

Kevin Pollak leaves a little bit of that door open. Could we see Mrs. May’s old movie?

I think it’s the door has been cracked. Look, the way they need content these days and you know that it’d be an Amazon film in a minute. And, you know, so they put it in theaters. They could get a lot of attention for it. And then you just put it on streaming again. I think we’ve seen the model for all of this.

And like I said, it would help pay the bills for all that expensive stuff that they’re using because it looks like a Cinemascope film. It’s shot. Well, it has great I mean, the scoring, they created original songs for this. Now, really for a half hour you’re going to do that. And the sets, the costumes, the whole and, you know, the first season they won a lot of Emmys for those kind of below the line things.

And I think this year they’re going to be well rewarded for what they’ve done because it is so vast and so unbelievable. But, you know, it did not go unnoticed by the actors. I think they believe that they landed into a great situation. And I don’t think it was by chance either that they were selected. I think these people, they knew who were the hard workers, they knew who the ones that would deliver for them.

And it it it seems like it’s a brutal show to do because it isn’t just getting up and saying a line against somebody. You know, what’s interesting is you’ll see a little a clip of a TV show that stars Hank Azaria and Sutton Foster within the show. It looks it has a bit of Dick Van Dike to the quality of it.

And Sutton Foster kind of seems like a mary Tyler Moore. And you think the idea that they would write this script for a show within a show that really isn’t seen that much, you get a couple of lines out of it. And, you know, they did you know, they probably wrote the whole script or this sitcom that they were trying to reference in some way.

And it’s done in black and white. And you get all of that that kind of little homage. But clearly they are fans of the medium. They are ones who want to make sure that it comes across and you do get that sense of what the time was like. You know, it was not easy being a female comedian in New York, Hollywood, wherever.

And I don’t I think now it just seems too easy because we see comedians all over the place, you know, doing a one hour special on Netflix. But the idea that somebody would have had that or got that an unreal, unreal. And if I was able to interview Joan Rivers Times and she net, you know, as much as she was kind of oh what’s the term I want to use not boisterous but she was you know, she seemed like a very like she would just tell it like it is and not worry about the consequences.

That was not Joan. It was a character that she was portraying. She was the most loving, wonderful person who would would take you under her arms and just treat you like a friend. And that’s the I think that’s the same kind of disconnect you get here with Mrs. Maisel. She is two different people, but I can see easily that she is the the Joan Rivers is the template for Mrs. Maisel, even though their lives are much different.

They don’t they don’t wind up the same way. They don’t have the same dynamics. There aren’t the same, you know, cards being played. But there is that kind of idea that I’m alone. I really am alone in this venture and I’ve got to do what I want to. Another series that it kind of seems similar to is Hacks, because you see Jean Smart showing what a comedian’s like after the big days are over and how does she keep that going?

And there’s a glimpse of that with this fascinating because I think I think Joan Rivers is the mothership for all these kinds of things because of what she did do and the idea that look at Joan went to QVC and sold crap just to make money, you know, and what she had to do, she alienated Johnny Carson at one point and then she had her own show.

But the one thing that she valued most was The Tonight Show. And there was no way they were going to let her back on with that because she had, you know, went as she had. She’d gone against the master and she wasn’t sorry enough for Johnny to make this really work. And I think that was a big failing in Joan’s life, is that she felt that somehow that relationship was not really repaired and she never got The Tonight Show.

She didn’t get things she wanted, but in the end, she did get a lot. And she is viewed as somebody they all look up to. You know, they say, well, I wouldn’t be here if it weren’t for Joan Rivers. And I think that’s the path that you’re looking at with Mrs. Maisel as well.

So with Mrs. May’s all leaving Prime Well, not really leaving. It’s going to be there, but but this is a big tentpole production for them. What’s left for Prime. They do have a lot of shows, but I also don’t find myself going to Prime very often for original programing. It feels like a weird, weird platform to me compared some of the others in some ways, maybe a little bit like Apple Tv+, which has several big productions.

But when there’s nothing there, you know, when you run out of something like Ted Lasso, it feels like there’s a long gap until something else comes. What what’s your thinking on on Prime right now?

I think, though, they’re doing movies and a lot of those movies will draw the attention. And so I think that’s where they’ll get whatever. And they also have a lot of limited series that are ten and down or eight and done. And I think that for them is a better model then a series that who knows if you know the the the suits the executives who are in power may not like that series.

And there it’s just like network TV. As soon as one regime is out, there’s do we have support? You know, unless you’re the number one show on television they’ll be looking to dump. Yeah.

So we’ve been sprinkling clips throughout this episode, which has been fun because we don’t always have audio from so many different people. But we do have one more and it’s a little bit more than just a 1015 second clip. We have an interview. Do you want to talk a little bit about that?

Yeah, I got to talk to it to Michael Zegen, who plays Mr. Maisel. And it’s fascinating because I was always under the impression that his job could be gone at any minute. I really thought that Joel is not necessary to this show. He was important in the first year, but would you stick around? And so we got to talk about that and what this last season was like and what, you know, what what comes next.

He is working on the Penguin, which is the new I think his HBO Max series with Colin Farrell, and he’s a mobster in that. And so that’s an excellent he’ll be doing it Fascinating. And he feels very blessed, very blessed that he was a part of this because he knows it’s magic in a bottle and you don’t get that many times.

Michael, how is it to say goodbye to this? I would think that would be very, very difficult.

It is You’re you’re correct in you’re you’re sentiments. Yeah it’s it’s it’s definitely difficult but it’s some I don’t know it doesn’t feel like it’s ended just yet especially you know we we still have all this and we’re going to France together and I you know we still have this group text chain. So it’s I don’t think it’ll ever quite feel over over.

But I, I, you know, I know the reality of it. And we’re not going to be filming anymore, which is devastating.

Well, the last season is so stuffed with information. I mean, there’s a lot there to unpack. What was it like when you were doing it? Did you say, Oh, my God, I can’t believe this happened? And that happened. And, you know, there’s a lot.

There is, but there’s always a lot. I feel like, yeah. And, you know, there’s a lot of dialog. I actually think this year the scripts, they’re always long, you know and I guess in our show is is supposed to be like, you know, 55 to 60 pages, our scripts are like 90 pages to 100 pages. So they’re always long.

I do feel like this this season, though, they were longer than most.

And the locations, I mean, you’re everywhere, you’re doing the years, the whole all of it. That’s why I thought it seemed like an awful lot. But maybe it’s let’s get it done and then move on to something else.

Well, the show is big. It’s been big from the beginning. You know, we went to Paris in the in the second season and the Catskills and Miami. So it’s it’s it’s always been very big. And yeah, I mean, there’s a lot of stuff, but somehow it just it still flows just as nicely as ever. And it’s, you know, it’s still.

When it started, did you feel, oh, they’re going to get rid of my character at some point.

I, I was just saying this in a in a previous interview. Yeah. In the first episode when I read it, I thought that was it for Joel and I thought it was going to be a guest star. I didn’t even I, I looked at the you know, I was auditioning for it. They send you the cast breakdown and it said that he was a series regular.

So I was like, Oh, even better. I had no idea. I really honestly thought this is it for him. And later. But but, you know, luckily that wasn’t the case. And they were able to to create this this whole journey for and this evolution for this character.

And there have been so many subplots of his that he just kind of owns. That must be a real cool feeling to have them kind of right for you, if you will.

Yeah, we all get our subplots. But yeah, I mean, I think Joel’s is is probably, I guess the most separate from from everybody else is they all kind of I mean, look, he’s still in Midge’s orbit, obviously, but but I think, you know, he’s probably the he’s like Pluto as opposed to, you know.

Tony’s not Venus. Right. What were you miss about this show? Because you had such a huge cast and of really great people?

Well, that’s what I mean. That’s in that’s it in a nutshell is the cast I, I, I, I’ll miss everyone terribly isn’t. And really, it’s not just the cast, it’s the crew. It’s it’s you know, our writers, Amy and Dan, obviously, I I’ll miss everything about this show. Literally everything. This has been the greatest experience of my life so far, you know, work wise.

I don’t I was just talking to Tony and Kevin Pollak and they were saying, you know, by the way, no way, you’re going to top this. So, like, they felt bad for me because they they were saying they’re like, you have like years and years left. We only have like three and, you know, and I’m on it. It’s over for me, basically.

But I mean, I don’t believe that, but I do I do believe that it’s going to be very hard to top something like this.

Do you think it’s because of the writing that made it such an iconic show or was it something else? Is it spending a lot of money and doing a lot of things, making it bigger than normal?

I think that the money is certainly helps. You know, luckily we had Amazon behind us and anything really Amy and Dan wanted they got because I think, you know, Amazon loved the show just as much as we did. But what was the first part of the question?

Well, did did you think that it was going to be this this big, this kind of whatever, or was it the writing that really kind of sold all of this thing?

It’s really everything. It’s the writing. It’s like I said before, the crew, I mean, we had, you know, people at the top of their game in every, you know, whether it’s lighting or set design or acting. I mean, it was just the whole the whole project was just lightning in a bottle. And and I think that’s that’s really just what made it so special.

But yeah, did I have any idea I, I didn’t know that it was going to be this big. I knew people were going to like it. I liked it. So, you know, I, I think I’ve got pretty good taste. And, you know, my if you look at my resume like I’ve done really good shows before and I’ve done shows that people watch.

But but this was this took it to a new level. And, you know, right out of the gate, we we got nominated for all these awards and we won and we won the Golden Globe, you know, And that that was like, okay, yeah, we were right. Like, this is something special. And and now, you know, then we had to top that.

And you got the Emmy. So there you go.

Talk about, though, Amy, as a as a force. I have my views of what she’d be like. I always see her in a hat and I always think she’s like, she’s marshaling troops. But is it like that or what is she like on on set?

She’s honestly just the best. You know, you talked about the writing. It doesn’t get better than that. And and honestly, like, I’m a little sore about the fact that for, you know, the past couple of years at the Emmys, she’s not even nominated for writing. I mean, this is the best written show on TV, you know. Yes. There’s succession.

There’s all these other shows. But like in terms of comedy, it doesn’t get better than this. And, you know, it’s so rare for me to read something, especially when I’m home alone and I laugh out loud. That doesn’t happen. And that’s been happening on this show from day one. The minute I read the pilot, I was I was laughing.

And and so, yeah, she’s she’s just, you know, there’s there’s a level of trust involved with her that that is unparalleled that I haven’t I haven’t experienced with anybody else. She shows up to set. I mean she’s a former dancer, you know, and she thinks like a dancer. So, so even even our background actors, a lot of them are dancers.

I don’t know if you know that, but it’s true. A lot of them are dancers and it’s it’s always a dance when we’re rehearsing a scene because we don’t have rehearsals, like prior to showing up to set and doing the scene. We, we, we get there on the day like, you know, 530 in the morning, whatever it is, and then we start blocking it out.

And sometimes they’re huge scenes. But I mean, you know, she’s she’s obviously in charge and there’s this level of trust that I’ll just do anything she wants because, you know, she knows what she wants. And to have a director who knows what they want is sometimes I mean, honestly, in my experience, it’s rare.

So what is it like watching Rachel do stand up?

I mean, Rachel can do anything. You know, she’s she always talks about how nervous she is. Like, I don’t buy it. Like she’s she’s a she can do anything. She she’s that type of actor where again, it’s that level of trust. Like, I mean, any time I got to work with her was a joy and all of our I think you know all of our scenes that we got to do together were always my favorite.

And yeah, I mean, you know, she talks about how nervous she is, how the audiences keep growing and growing for her character. And honestly, like, that stuff doesn’t faze her. She was born to perform. And, you know, I don’t I don’t know if she would be a standup comedian, but but I’m sure she can handle that as well if she wanted to.

Hey, and you can, too. So that might be even the next step. So. Hey, thank you so much, Michael. I appreciate it. And I thank you for all those years of really great television.

Oh, thanks so much. I appreciate it.

Thanks, Bruce, for that interview with Michael Zegen. What do we have on tap?

Well, I’ll tell you, I do. And tell me if you don’t agree when you start watching this, this series by, because I think it’s going to be in for a lot of Emmys, you know how they come and go. And they kind of had a down year. Never. They weren’t getting nominated. And the things I think this year they’re coming back with a vengeance.

And I don’t know how you could deny Rachel Brosnahan, the Emmy for best actress. Really? There are there is a moment there that you will go, Oh, my God, I’m glad I watch this series because it builds to this moment and it’s unbelievable. And you’ll, as you heard from Michael, you know, watching her was just unbelievable. But next week, we’re going to talk about dead ringers.

Here’s another opportunity. And you wondered, where is Amazon going? Well, this is another series they’ve got, but it’s a limited series. It’s based off a movie. If you remember the movie by David Cronenberg, starring Jeremy Irons, he played brothers, twin brothers who were odd, to say the least, and they were involved in obstetrics and making all kinds of weird tools and instruments and whatnot.

And they had freaky obsessions. They I mean, watch the movie. You’ll see what I mean. It was one of those movies. Take me out for the longest time. Well, they’ve redone the movie and it’s now a limited series, and it features two women as twins. Beverly and Elliot Mantle are now played by Rachel Weisz and Rachel really digs into it.

She’s and she has lots of fun. And you’ll see a different Beverly and a different Elliot. And then it’s at one point they play each other to try and dupe their friends. So it’s a fascinating look at characters, but I do think they made a horrible land. I just kind of have that feeling knowing how the movie went.

But that’s next. We were talking to people who were involved in Dead Ringers, and that’ll be coming as a limited series later this month.

All right, Bruce, thanks again, as always. And tune in again next week for another episode of Streaming & Screened.